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#024 – The most inspirational live music I’ve ever heard was performed by Tennessee talent Chad Jeffers.

He has shared his gift on tour with country music stars Carrie Underwood, Keith Urban, and Kenny Loggins. And now he shares his message of hope and resilience on this week’s podcast episode.


Chad talks about how his band was dropped from a major recording label, and in that moment of rejection he took action that led to becoming “the guy” major country stars needed in their group for major touring events.

How can you turn challenges into opportunities that will fuel your future? Listen to find your answers.


Thank you for listening and please share.

Always Forward,


Resources Mentioned:

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  • All social media channels: @chadjeffers
  • Podcast: The Chad Jeffers Show

Chad Jeffers 0:04

The way I feel about resilience is it's almost a muscle. And so if you have small, resilient moments, they start leading up to bigger resilience. And I think as you do as you have that resilience, then you're more hopeful.

Joe Pomeroy 0:22

Hey, everybody, welcome to today's episode of the Forward with Joe Pomeroy cast. I'm excited to have guest Chad Jeffers with us today. Welcome, Chad. How are you?

Chad Jeffers 0:32

Hey, Joe. Thank you for having me. Glad to be here.

Joe Pomeroy 0:35

All right now, I'm going to brag on you a little bit Chad because I know you're so down to earth and humble dude that you're not going to brag on yourself. So I've been to a few concerts in my day. And I've seen some really awesome performances Maroon five john mayer Barenaked Ladies back in the 90s, things like that. Just some amazing entertaining performers. I still to this day, we'll never forget the opportunity. I had to listen to Chad. Play adobo. I mean, this is something that it lays horizontal, you don't necessarily hold it against your chest. And it was one of the most moving things I've ever seen. And just seeing Chad get lost in the music, and just playing and just getting lost in that moment with him. And this this small event, super small venue that was as powerful and moving as anything I've ever seen from any musician in my entire life. And that talent is recognized with some of the groups that you've been able to tour with. So tell us about that really quick.

Chad Jeffers 1:33

Yeah, my career in music has has taken me many different places, and with many different artists, started out with a Canadian group. So we toured all over Canada, a lot of times in January, February, which was a little crazy. Thompson, Manitoba, and it was like minus 20 degrees and oh, but yeah, but it was fun being with those guys, and then eventually I had my own band. We got signed to RCA We only sold 80,000 units. So that was a failure in terms of being with a major label. But so soon after that, I got a gig with Keith Urban. So I toured with Keith, and then eventually Kenny Loggins. And then for the last 13 years, I've been out with Carrie Underwood. So it's it's been amazing to be in with these just stellar artists and learning along the way of everything, you know, through touring.

Joe Pomeroy 2:23

That's fantastic. I think one of the things that is so interesting to me in conversations we've had in the past is that success in the music industry is so challenging. I mean, you talked about having your own band and signing with a major label. And you guys technically had a failure, you sold 80,000 units, but it's considered a failure, and yet to still be able to move on and to continue forward and to find success. And so I'm excited to talk about in one word, hope you mentioned, you know, talking about hope today and I think with everything going on, in general, as a human society, we need to find Hope but specifically with today with, with the things going on with the lack of unity within the nation with the health crises and the riots and things, there's just if we can find that hope. So how have you discovered hope in your life, whether through the music industry or in general? Where does that hope for you come from? And how do you work on that?

Chad Jeffers 3:21

Well, a longtime mentor of mine, Dan Miller, who's a best selling author, and just incredibly successful, but I love one of the the phrases that he uses during downtimes like this, or during, maybe, let's say obstacles or challenges. He Norton, He never says the word problem. He always has obstacles or challenges. And the phrase that he uses is, what does this make possible? And I love that because instead of saying, Oh, this is awful, we're screwed. It's more of an open ended question of looking And being hopeful. So to put that into like something of action, another friend of dance that a mutual friend of ours, I was talking with him the other day, and he is a speaker. Well, as we know, everything in terms of public events or anything, where there's more than a couple of people gathered, has been canceled for pretty much probably most of the year, you know, 2020. So he asked himself, okay, what does this make possible? And what he did was started doing more virtual events, the zoom or, you know, video platforms, and he increased his revenue by I don't know, it was like 50 or $60,000 this year just by doing that, and he didn't have to travel. And more importantly, what what's interesting is, he said everything worked great. But he said what was really fascinating is that the the event planners came back to them, they said, you know, even when we start getting people back together, This was so impactful, and the just how you set it up and everything, we want to keep doing this. So looking into 2020, you know, what does this make possible? Well, he can still do all of his live events, hopefully, we can gather in public again, on top of doing this, which added another 50 60,000 to his annual income.

Joe Pomeroy 5:21

That's fantastic.

Chad Jeffers 5:22

And and you're seeing that a lot also with artists where, you know, they can't get out and play. So they're doing living room concerts and doing virtual tip jars, and you know, Patreon type of things that help keep them going in their business. And it'll be interesting to see because I think that that's something that they can continue doing even after they start playing out. You know, so if they have a day off, they could say, you know, Hey, I'll play for 30 minutes or an hour here in my house, so I don't have to travel anywhere. I don't have to lug my gear anywhere, you know, so why not?

Joe Pomeroy 5:53

Yeah. Alright, so Chad, what's something specific to you? What's a story in your journey where you felt hopeless, and maybe maybe the challenges and opportunities didn't feel like challenges and opportunities. It only felt like a problem. I mean, is that in your wheelhouse of how you've viewed things in the past?

Chad Jeffers 6:14

Yes, for me, my growth definitely has come from, not necessarily. I mean, bad things happen to everybody. And challenges happen to everyone. And I don't think it's necessarily what happens, but it's how you deal with it. We see this time and time again, especially musicians and entertainers on stage. When you're on a stage and I don't care if you're in a club, or even given a talk, or if you're on a stage like what we had with the crowd, pretty tour 360 out with Carrie Underwood, where you know, we had 18 - 20 trucks and you know, we carried our own stage and lighting and video and pyrotechnics and everything. There's always going to be something that that doesn't go the way that you planned and it's not what happens But it's how you deal with it. That makes all the difference in the world. I've been with artists where, you know, just challenges have happened where they're basically standing there. I believe it was with with Keith, what happened? There was something where basically so much of like the sound went out except his vocal mic. And so, hey, what does this make possible? Well, he was able to just talk to the crowd. Hey, guys, man, I don't know what just happened. But this is crazy. Hey, guys. You know, and he just basically did like a stand up comic kind of thing. And people loved it. People loved it. And they weren't like, Oh my gosh, I want my money back. Because, you know, there was five minutes or 10 minutes with no music, you know, they loved it because it was that human element that that he gave to them. And I think for me, it's it's been once again, it's not what happens but it how you deal with it is all the difference in the world, and also how fast you can bounce back from it. Whatever. That challenge may be when we got my band pin monkey when pin monkey. Yeah. And there's a country man. I know. Pin monkey was the guy that you set up the bowling pins before the days of automation. And we got it from the Simpsons where Homer wanted to quit his job to become a pin monk. Anyway, it's stuck. I don't know how but it stuck.

Joe Pomeroy 8:21


Chad Jeffers 8:22

And so when we when we lost her a recording contract with RCA, we're in our manager's office and you know, he just came in and we're all sitting at his board table and he said, hey, look, they're not moving forward with the song not moving forward, the project moving forward with the artist. And we're like, ah, bummer. Okay, bummer. All right, let's start recording an independent album. And it was that moment that we just, you know, within five minutes of feeling sorry for ourselves, you know, five minutes turned to Okay. Hey, let's What's next? Let's do An album let's record an album. And the fascinating part about that this is where I think a lot of blessings or serendipitous or whatever you want to call it comes into play. But the the producer that was producing this gentleman named Mark bright. And so our manager called him who he was manage, or he was producing our big label deal, you know, our RCA. So when we once we got dropped, our manager called and said, Hey, they got dropped, but they want to do an independent album. He said, I'm on board. Absolutely. Let's do this thing. And it was through that albums when I got to know Mark really, really well. who by the way, Mark is also the one that produced Carrie Underwood, Rascal Flatts, Reba McEntire, and wow. And then whenever the carry whenever they're looking for a slide guitar player, of course, marks like I got your guy, you need to call this guy. And so years later, you know, of course at that moment when we got dropped I wasn't thinking, okay, because Carrie wasn't even on the scene. She hadn't even didn't even do American Idol yet. And so there's no way for me to, okay, I can't wait to play with this artist, you know, it's just me having faith and being hopeful in the process of everything that that I was working towards.

Joe Pomeroy 10:17

Okay, so does that. Is that like something that's just always been your nature to be so resilient to bounce back so fast?

Chad Jeffers 10:26

Yes, and no, I think it's not necessarily across the board. Uh, yes. But I think in certain areas, because, in especially being in the music business, there's failure all the time. That's just part of it. And I'm a songwriter, too. So anytime I pitch a song to an artist, it's always, not always but a lot of times it's no, no, no, no. And then if you get that one yes, out of 50 then that's a success in our business. You know, it's much like a, you know, like it with anything in terms of like being a bank. at bat, if you hit if you get on base three times, that's 300 average. That's awesome. You know?

Joe Pomeroy 11:06

Yeah, seriously, I've always thought about that because it's like, having to work through my own challenges with perfectionism and and resiliency and things like that. And, and those for me, I don't think, well, the resiliency is something that I've had to work to develop. And I've always used that baseball analogy of the idea that, you know, look at people that are making it to all star games, they strike out, they get out, they fly out, whatever, 70% of the time. They're not, quote, unquote, succeeding, but it's that 30% it's that ability to next time they step up to the plate every time they feel like, you know, they have the mindset, the mentality that hey, this is this is a new shot. Everything that happened in the past doesn't exist. So it and from what you're saying, like that's the same thing in the music industry. And what's propelled you to the success that you do have is the ability to just get right back up and say, Alright, let's start Hands off and get back to work.

Chad Jeffers 12:01

Yeah, and I think that's a really important part that you mentioned there in terms of resiliency is, let's say, as a musician, you just you Bama solo, well, then there's a next song, what you can't keep thinking you can't, you know, stay on that the bomb that you just made, you've got to keep going, because there's a whole rest of the show that you need to perform. And if you stay in the moment of the bomb that you just did on that solo, well, you're, you're depriving everyone have a great rest of the performance. So I think it goes Same thing with hand in hand with with, you know, batters, you know, you get up, you strike out, well, the next time you get up, it's a fresh start. You've got another, you know, you've got another go at making something great at getting a hit or getting a home run. But I think that, you know, it's in terms of having a short memory, forgetting it and focusing on the now and being in the present in that moment right then and there.

Joe Pomeroy 12:58

I like to I actually, I I think I might switch from the baseball analogy to the music analogy for the rest of my life because you just spoke to something that really makes sense to me. And you can see this is true for sports too. But we'll we'll run with the music thing since since that's your gig. It's not just the rest of the group. It's not, you know, the face of the group, you know, it's not carry, it's not the other band members. It's everybody in that audience that wants to connect that wants to feel through the music. And I wasn't expecting to tie my the first story I told about you back into this. But that night, that was really moving. There were some really powerful things that happened in the mastermind at our live event earlier in the day and some things for me to think about. And then that's how we wrapped up the night was with you playing and doing some of those things. There are some I think Kim deardorff, he played as well and stuff and,

Chad Jeffers 13:49

and David Ask

Joe Pomeroy 13:50

Yeah, that's right. That's right. So all of those things and being able to connect into that emotion. Just took everything else from the day and maybe Get that much deeper. So now you transition to a concert and everybody that's coming and and regardless of the size of the venue, everybody has their own story, their own experiences that day, their own things going on in their mind. And they need you to connect with the music like you can and deliver that performance to help them connect with what they need to. And that's the same in life and business, whatever it is that we're doing. There's just people that they need us to connect with what we're doing so that they can feed off of that and that they can enjoy it. And if we're not resilient, then it's it's a whole who knows how large that audience is. That's missing out because we chose not to get back up.

Chad Jeffers 14:42

Right 100%. And, yeah, I feel that the better you can do with being resilient, the less you're going to deprive other people of helping them and whether whether that's helping them through a motivation talk or whether that's helping them through through music or other means. It may be subconsciously that's why I've, I've worked so hard to become more resilient is for that reason.

Joe Pomeroy 15:07

I Well, let's have a chicken in the egg question. So we started out talking about hope. And as we talked about hope that conversation has really what we've been talking about for the last several minutes is being resilient getting back up. So which comes first? Is it does the hope come first? And and because you have hope you're resilient? Or is the resilient come up, and maybe you don't feel that hope? But once you start moving the wheels again, the hope comes like chicken in the egg. What comes first, Chad?

Chad Jeffers 15:35

Well, I mean, I think starting out, you always have to have hope. The way I feel about resilience is it's almost a muscle. And so if you have small, resilient moments, they start leading up to bigger resilience. And I think as you do as you have that resilience, then you're more hopeful. And I think also is having the people around you that helped guide you and help give you the Truth and help give you the encouragement. That's also a big part of hope for me. You know, Jim Rohn always says, you know, you're the average of the five people you spend the time most time with. And I think that that's also true in terms of being around hopeful people who, you know, when you get knocked down, they're like, Hey, man, wait goes, come on, let's go. Come on, let's get out. And about the energy and you're like, Alright, yeah, I can do this. And you go forward again. Because once again, I think resilience is is a muscle that you build up.

Joe Pomeroy 16:31

That makes sense and, and I think, for anyone listening that maybe is struggling to have hope are struggling to feel resilient, or, you know, well, I survived the first lockdown. And then we started opening up some and now we just got locked down again, and what you know, what's the point? Those are some, to be honest, those are some thoughts that I've had and I've had to exercise my resilient muscle. But it's I like what you talked about where it's, it's the small things and you do those small things and create the consistency and then as Larger challenges present themselves you know have the muscle to do that it's like with any other muscle you know, I can't go into the gym and slap on three 4 45 plates I'll probably never be able to go to the town there's I remember somebody I don't remember where I heard this but they said this shirt hides a multitude of sins like rugs, junk the lack of exercise but you know, it's it's being it's being practical it's having those healthy realistic expectations doing that, that taking that next right step be resilient once Don't worry about what's going to hit next and whether or not you can stand back up after that. And going back to your story with with pin monkey, I just wanted to bring pin monkey back into that so we could say the name again and say yeah, no wonder it's stuck. But that too I mean, that's a group of guys. I was there anybody in that room when that news came down? You guys well, let's release an independent album. Was there anybody in the group that was like No, guys, there's no point let's quit now.

Chad Jeffers 18:02

No, we were all on it. We're, you know, like a and because we had an independent album before we got signed to RCA. So we've already been down the road. So let's let's just do it again.

Joe Pomeroy 18:13

Yeah. So having that group with you, those people with you, to help you move forward. I was just having a call. I had a conversation with someone not too long ago that they talked about, there's no such thing as doing it by yourself. There's no such thing as doing your own thing. That whether, you know, with with the people that you've toured with, you know, Keith Urban's the name Carrie Underwood's, the name they're the face of it, but carry can't play the guitar like you can, she can't do the pyrotechnics and the lighting and, and set up the stage. I mean, tremendous human being I'm sure she could figure things out if she put her mind to it. But that's so much work and so much effort. And so it's needing that group with you. It's seeing the person on percussions and guitar and keyboards and everything else that so What are you doing in your life now? And how are you helping others to be surrounded by the right people? Almost like personal trainers for that resilient muscle?

Chad Jeffers 19:11

Yeah, well, one thing I've got a podcast the Chad Jeffers show nice, shameless plug. And that's one thing we talked about in terms of just keeping the people around you. And also I'm a big believer in mentors. And in terms of the resiliency and since that's kind of the the magic word of the day, you know, with resilience is is having a mentor. So with with me back to the pin monkey, my mentor is Jimmy Olander, who was in a band called Diamond Rio, which is a country band, one of the most successful country bands in country music history. They're still together. It's been 37 years. And he's been my longtime mentor. And so he was the first person I called whenever we got signed, you know, where I'm like, Oh, this is awesome. Yeah. You know, when I'm like, What do I do now? On Sunday, people their goal was just to get signed. But that's actually when the work starts. Yeah. And anyway, so he guided me along. And so when we lost her deal, he was also one of the first people I called, I said, Jimmy, we got dropped. What do I do now? You know, and he, and he was the one that mentioned, you know, Hey, you guys, you need to do that independent album, and you need to continue writing and you need, you know, he has given me all the push and the hope. And that's what I hope to do with other people, in terms of whether it's music or whether it's other businesses. I'm also coaching people as well. And there is a lady that I've been coaching that because of the events of this world, she she was in retail, and so she had to shut down a retail stores. So I asked her, I said, what does this make possible for you? And I mean, her, her eyes just lit up and she's like, Oh my gosh, you know, you just opened up a different world to me. And so that's what I like doing is helping. Just not telling people anything, but just shining a light saying hey, Have you thought about this? Or have you thought about, you know, maybe in a different direction, you know, taking all of your expertise and your talents and just applying it in a different form. And that's one thing I love doing. As much as I love being on stage that is like the other. That's the other high that I get is whenever I see people's light bulbs go off in their eyes brighten up. It's just so fun. I love doing that. Which is why I was also a professor at Belmont and teaching students you know about the music business. And just to see, just to give them a glimpse of what the possibilities to me that that's delivering hope.

Joe Pomeroy 21:39

So it's interesting, you talk about shining a light on things. And that made me think of the moon. The moon in and of itself doesn't produce light, it reflects the light of the sun. But the reflection of that light doesn't do anything for the moon. The moon's not like, Oh, I'm reflecting my light and suddenly now I'm better I'm you know, things are more wonderful I am, it's, it's the sharing of that light that creates benefit, I can't generate my own light necessarily, I can reflect the light that I received from others and then share that with others to give them the opportunity to continue that path and continue reflecting I think it's when we try to hold that in when we try to collect that lightning in the bottle and just contain it that we lose it

Chad Jeffers 22:29

100% and and the analogy that I always use is that if if I've got a candle that's lit and then someone else has a candle that is not lit, and I like you know, I take my candle and I like their candle. My light does not diminish but I'm spreading light because now we have two burning candles. And I like to use that because that's the way I feel. I try to do with my coaching and with music with with everything that I do. You know by lighting someone else This candle yours is not any dimmer. So it just brightens the world up just a little bit more.

Joe Pomeroy 23:05

That is way better than my moon analogy.

Chad Jeffers 23:08

No. I like it.

Joe Pomeroy 23:14

So the other thing that I thought of so if you have a single candle in a room in a cave and whatever and it's dark and you've got a single candle, and you'd like that other candle, not only does it not diminish your light, but now those two lights combined, light the room up brighter, and you can now see more.

Chad Jeffers 23:32

Yeah, and how many times have you taught someone something? And they learn it, but you're like, I think I learned it even better than what they just learned it.

Joe Pomeroy 23:41

Oh, for sure.

Chad Jeffers 23:42

That goes along with a candle analogy.

Joe Pomeroy 23:45

I love that. So all right. So we're talking about hope and resilience. If you hold on to what you have inside of you to yourself, it's not really benefiting you and so to be able to share that and give that to others. So what are some specific to tools that you use to help you stay conscious about this as you go throughout your day. I mean, do you walk around with the guy to share my light? Come share my light? Where's the light? Like, what do you do? What do you do?

Chad Jeffers 24:10

Well, fortunately, I mean, because I'm able to coach and also I'm in a couple of masterminds, that light is I'm always trying to share different ideas. But yeah, more than anything, I tried to do that through my music and through songwriting, and through and through my podcast is shared because right now, especially, there's not as much one on one interaction with hardly anybody but in whatever form I can do, I tried to share the light and sometimes maybe that's just holding a door for someone or maybe, you know, they just small things. So many times people think Well, I've got to do something grandiose or you know, something on a large scale, to share your light when actually a smile to someone especially right now. You know, if you lower your mask, smile at somebody. But But you know, every You know, I walk a lot on a green trail on the rec trail around close to where I live, and just smiling at somebody. I think that that, you know that in and of itself, especially in the times we're in right now, I think that that's something that that you can, you can share your light doesn't cost you a thing, and it can bring happiness to someone else.

Joe Pomeroy 25:21

You just reminded me of a story when I was in high school, there were many times at the end of the day where I might be staying longer, not a ton longer, but long enough for the initial rush of students was gone. And then I'd be walking out to the parking lot to my car and an ex girlfriend would be walking by and things didn't end badly. They just ended. And to this day, one of my regrets is that I would just stare at the ground. I mean, we're talking my entire junior and probably senior year that this happened once a week and this was

Chad Jeffers 25:52

how many ex girlfriends did you have?

Joe Pomeroy 25:54

It was just one No, it's the same one but Was it was terrible. And I'm looking back on that now. But what would it cost me to smile? Or say hi? And why didn't I? Was she supposed to say hi first? What was the story? And was there anything about that story that made it worth it to not smile at that human being that I even had a past connection with? So yeah, in the simple things, like, I still find myself like if I'm walking on a green belt or something and somebody coming up, and I'm like, are they gonna think I'm weird if I smile or say hi, and I just got to the point where I just I don't care. And sometimes I'll smile and say hi, and people will look at me like, I'm weird. And then I just laugh at it, but you know,

Chad Jeffers 26:39

well, and your ex girlfriend smiling bit, you know, I think that goes back to resilience. And I try to do the right thing right now in the present moment. And so the resilience you know, in terms of kind of having a short memory of whatever it was, you know, barring you know, your personal health or well being or safety, whatever, but you know, just having short a short memory, so You just do what's best right now. So if it isn't ex girlfriend, hey, smile and keep keep going, or, you know, whatever it may be. I just find it useful just to stay present in the moment now and do the right thing right now,

Joe Pomeroy 27:14

you just made me think of something that I've never thought about this way. I've heard they have a short memory before rusty Ryal, he was on my show before one of the earlier episodes and he's a former Major League Baseball player and somebody I got to become friends with he and his wife. And he would talk about that having a short memory if you made an error in the field, or if you struck out or whatever, you have to have a short memory. And I've always thought of it, the short memory is we're going to cut that line that goes to the past, but part of the problem if that's the only focus and what I find myself is that it's like okay, I'm in the moment, not gonna worry about I'm just going to do my thing. But I start thinking about what might happen or what could happen and I start projecting into the future, which inevitably ties one of the possibilities is what happened in the past. And so then it's almost like it reconnects that. So really, to have a short memory is to be in the present. And this element of resilience part of being resilient, is you got to focus on the present and just think, what's the result that I want right now?

Chad Jeffers 28:16

Yeah. And that's just the way that I try to live my life. And I've, because I've done it the other way, where, you know, I would hold on to things and, you know, doubt myself and whatever was going on in the future. I'm like, No, well, I tried that before. And that didn't work because you know, all this crazy stuff. Whereas I kind of just let all that go, and also not be fearful of the future. Because the future hasn't happened yet. That doesn't mean like a preparation because I'm always preparing for if it's a performance or if it's a coaching call, whatever it may be, I'm always preparing. But I'm not fearful of it. Because I've found that if I stay in the moment, stay present. things work out.

Joe Pomeroy 28:59

How have you taught yourself to stay in the present?

Chad Jeffers 29:03

Breathe. Just focus on breath. And I'm not talking to you know, light incense, sit on a mat meditate for 30 minutes. Which you mean that's helpful helpful too. But to me, it's it's literally taking, you know, pause, you know, pause when agitated, and and just breathe, you know, take three deep breaths. there's a there's a guy that's in the Nashville area here and he's a doctor. He's a voice doctor and they call him the voice doc. But here's his whole premise is breathe. Whenever you have fear, breathe, whenever you're in doubt, have something breathe. Whenever you're anxious about something breathe. And and it's so true because it and i think it's it's one thing, it's getting oxygen to the brain, which sometimes I think if you get excited or fearful or something, because your breath patterns change, this is a way to reset a lot of things. And just gives you, you know, get 5 - 10 seconds to take inventory of what's going on. What's really going on, not what's going on in your mind, but in your, you know, your environment, what's going on. And so for me that that's its brief. And usually people go, No, I want give me like the magic answer. You know, give me give me the secret sauce.

Joe Pomeroy 30:21

That's too easy. Chad.

Chad Jeffers 30:22

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so brief. And and I mean, before I go on stage, you know, it's three deep breaths. Let's get in the moment. Let's stay present. Here we go.

Joe Pomeroy 30:35

It makes sense. I mean, anytime I've got a six, four and two year old when my six and four year olds start getting in with with each other arguing or notice or know that. I mean, what I taught I like guys, slow down, slow down. And the idea what I'm trying to teach him is like, slow down, step back. And let's just look at the situation for what it is. And we'll find that path out and it's It's something that to me is so simple to tell them. Hey, guys, just slow down, just slow down. That's all you need to slow down. And then the essence of that is is pausing and taking that time to breathe and with what you're talking about breathing, it's it's achieving the same goal. All right? Well, I always ask everybody on the show, if there's one principle you hope listeners will walk away with, what would that be? And the second question, how can people listen to your podcast? Do you have a special offer follow you connect with you all that good stuff?

Chad Jeffers 31:30

I think the takeaway from this is, the resilience is is in you. Everyone's got it. And it's just a matter of the discipline of the small, like what we were talking about small resilience and bouncing back, which leads to hope. I think that that's, I think you're golden. I mean, if you start those practices, I think you'll see a huge change in your life, little by little come about in terms of finding me. I'm on all socials, Chad Jeffers je FF ers, and also the Chad Jeffers show which is on podcast platforms IE music iTunes. Yeah. And there's a special offer. Basically, if you go to backstage notes calm, which is my course in terms of getting into the music business and learning how the music business works. And I interview seven different experts in the music business hit songwriters Grammy Award winning artists, Taylor Swift's old manager, show producers everything. It's a chock full of information. But you can go to backstage notes, calm and download a free pdf of how you can be performance ready. So whether you're walking into a boardroom to give a talk to, you know, your co workers, or if you're stepping on a stage of any size, this is some some guidelines to help you become performance ready.

Joe Pomeroy 32:50

Thank you so much, Chad. I really appreciate your time. There's so much value in the things that we're able to talk about and highly applicable to this moment. Especially when you talk About a, it's not some big thing, those small steps just like you talked about those small, small, small steps, build those muscles be resilient. Thank you, Chad. Appreciate your time.

Chad Jeffers 33:10

Thanks, Joe. Thanks for having me.

Joe Pomeroy 33:15

thank you for joining us on today's episode. If you found the information helpful, remember to share it with your friends and family. And make sure to subscribe on Apple podcasts or your favorite podcast player. You can find more episodes at forward with Joe calm. Thank you and we'll see you next time.